KMLM List

["Selden Lamoureux" <selden_lamoureux@xxxxxxxx>]

Hey Bob.  Thanks!  Well spoken, as always.  It sounds like it could be 
implemented pretty easily once the numbers were pinned down.   I wonder if we 
could get together and talk a little more about just what the number of 
chapters per year(s) would work.  I'll give you a call.



The next is a bit of an aside, since I've always been fuzzy about CONTU 
guidelines.  I just Googled them and found this from the Copyright Clearance 
Center 
(http://www.copyright.com/Services/copyrightoncampus/content/ill_contu.html ;): 
 
1.  CONTU Guidelines for copying from periodicals apply only to materials less 
than five years old (referred to as part of the "rule of five"). 

2.  Up to five articles may be copied from a single periodical in one calendar 
year under the ILL provision (referred to as part of the "rule of five"). 

3.  A library with a subscription for a periodical which is not immediately 
available may consider a copy obtained from another library as if made from its 
own collection. 

4.  All ILL requests must be accompanied by a copyright compliance statement 
from the requesting library. The requesting library must maintain records of 
all requests and of their fulfillment. These records must be kept for three 
calendar years after the request has been made. 

5.  No more than six copies of articles/chapters/small portions may be made 
from a non-periodical (including a book) during the entire term of copyright of 
the work. 
 

I would have passed the test if quizzed on the first 2 points, but didn't have 
any idea about #5.  Is this the common interpretation of CONTU Guidelines?  How 
would anyone be able to track that over the length of the copyright (especially 
since records are required for only 3 years)?  I think Bob is right to suggest 
something like CONTU but not CONTU itself.  We might also need the ILL experts 
to weigh in on their practice with ILL and print books when copying is involved 
(it requires estimating the percentage of a book copied if I remember correctly)


Anyway, thanks so much for raising the question.  It certainly comes at a good 
time.


Selden


>>> "Boissy, Robert, Springer US" <Robert.Boissy@xxxxxxxxxxxx> 6/15/2010 5:35 
>>> PM >>>
I would recommend chapter-level eBook ILL as the standard loan. 

There are commercial models for whole book loans for 30 day periods, so that 
would be treading into the commercial zone.

I would also recommend limits on # of eBook chapters per book per borrowing 
library, especially for recent content.  Some kind of CONTU limits. The main 
theme of ILL and shared understandings like CONTU is that when a certain amount 
of fair lending has been done to a borrowing library from the same resource, 
the borrowing library really must make their own purchase.  

Five chapters from the same book by the same library within a x year period 
from publication of the eBook?
  
-Bob
Sent from my Blackberry 

----- Original Message -----
From: Selden Lamoureux <selden_lamoureux@xxxxxxxx>
To: David Parker <david.parker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>; Oliver Pesch 
<OPesch@xxxxxxxxx>; Boissy, Robert, Springer US
Cc: Jody Atkinson <J.Atkinson@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>; Tim Williams <tim@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>; 
seruinfo@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <seruinfo@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>; lwobbe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx 
<lwobbe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>; Carol A Ficken <cficken@xxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Tue Jun 15 16:40:55 2010
Subject: Re: [seruinfo] SERU and ILL


Hi. Apologies for joining the discussion late, but like David, I'm not entirely 
sure how SERU works for e-book ILL.  Like Bob, however, I'm hoping that it can.


SERU was originally conceived of as an alternative to licensing e-journals, 
especially from small publishers who lacked the resources to hire lawyers to 
create a license,  and staff to negotiate and process changes.  The SERU 
working group, however, very deliberately left the SERU document flexible 
enough to allow it to be adapted to whatever situations libraries and 
publishers were comfortable with.


Much to my surprise SERU has gotten some very good support from large 
publishers. (My library has successfully used SERU for Springer e-Books as well 
as a multi-year consortial journal deal, something I never expected.)  


ILL, however, poses special challenges.  It was relatively easy to move from 
print to online journal articles, since the ILL secure transmission process is 
identical once the copy is made and there are well established norms (CONTU 
Guidelines being one codification of them).  But books are another matter.  
There is no expectation that a book will be copied (as would an article), and 
I'm not sure what it means to lend a copy of an e-book.  One of the major 
differences between ILL for e-journals and ILL for e-books is we don't have 
years of experience lending e-books, and there hasn't been a chance for a 
common understanding to grow.


I'd love to follow up on e-book ILL.  While it doesn't look like there's any 
shared understanding at the moment, it'd be great to have the conversations 
that will establish one.


I have talked with our ILL Librarian, James Harper, about just this topic.  In 
general, he thought he would be most likely to lend article-like e-book 
chapters but not an entire e-book.  I have been meaning to corner Bob and ask 
him about his notions of how ILL would work with the Springer e-books ... Bob, 
this might just be the moment!

Selden
********************************************
Selden Durgom Lamoureux
Electronic Resources Librarian
North Carolina State University Libraries
Campus Box 7111
Raleigh, NC 27695-7111

phone:  919-513-2728
fax:  919-515-7282
email:  selden_lamoureux@xxxxxxxx 
********************************************


>>> "Boissy, Robert, Springer US" <Robert.Boissy@xxxxxxxxxxxx> 6/14/2010 12:55 
>>> PM >>>
An interesting point David, as we make our content available the same
way.  But the combination of copyright law, fair use, and the statement
by the National Commission on New Technological Uses of Copyright Works
(CONTU) still applies to the ILL environment.
http://www.cni.org/docs/infopols/CONTU.html ;

 

ILL also costs time and money for both the lender and borrower.

 

In the USA, we feel there is a well understood, self-regulating
environment.  Countries with similar environments are suitable for SERU
use.  Some countries are not suitable, and we would likely turn down
requests to use SERU in some countries.  I will leave these countries
un-named.  Conditions can always change.

 

Does anyone know if the CONTU statements have ever been updated (aside
from SERU itself)?

 

-Bob

 

Robert W. Boissy

Springer

Tel: +1 781 244 7918

robert.boissy@xxxxxxxxxxxx 

 

From: seruinfo@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:seruinfo@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf
Of David Parker
Sent: Monday, June 14, 2010 12:45 PM
To: Oliver Pesch
Cc: Tim Williams; Ficken,Carol A; Jody Atkinson; lwobbe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx;
seruinfo@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
Subject: Re: [seruinfo] Cost?

 

Hi all,

 

I apologize if this question is reaching you twice as I chimed in on
another similar threaded discussion. We are a relatively new publisher
do concise e-books on business topics which we offer as a perpetual,
unlimited use, no-DRM collection and we are signed on with SERU, but I
am somewhat concerned about the inter library loan function in the SERU.
For an e-book publisher with an easily replicable product and no DRM
wrapped around it, inter library loan could, in the extreme, mean one
library could supply endless libraries with our books.


David Parker
Publisher
Business Expert Press
201-673-8784



On Mon, Jun 14, 2010 at 12:39 PM, Oliver Pesch <OPesch@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

We had a situation at EBSCO where a government institution was being
told by their higher-ups that the librarians were not authorized to
enter into legal contracts on behalf of the government (e.g. signing a
publisher license agreement was no longer an option)... We recommended
SERU and that turned out to be the answer. Because with SERU there is no
license to sign --  problem solved!


-----Original Message-----
From: seruinfo@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:seruinfo@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf

Of Tim Williams
Sent: Monday, June 14, 2010 10:25 AM
To: Ficken,Carol A; Jody Atkinson; lwobbe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx;
seruinfo@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 

Subject: Re: [seruinfo] Cost?

Hi all

I agree with Carol

We adopted SERU for our new journal of Human Rights and the Environment
(www.e-elgar.co.uk/jhre) after we had feedback from a librarian at a
major
university that it would allow them to subscribe immediately rather than
spend time negotiating and waiting for a committee to approve the
license
agreement.

Tim Williams


--
NEW: Journal of Human Rights & the Environment - download the first
issue
free www.e-elgar.com/jhre 
--
Tim Williams
Managing Director
Edward Elgar Publishing Ltd

The Lypiatts,  15 Lansdown Road,  Cheltenham,  GL50 2JA  |  Tel: +44
(0)1242
226934  |  A family business in international publishing
Edward Elgar Publishing Limited is registered in the UK at the above
address. Registered number: 2041703



On 6/14/10 1:44 PM, "Ficken,Carol A" <cficken@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> We (University of Akron) are registered with SERU, and I do use it
when
> possible.  More publishers are registering and it does save time
(money).  At
> a recent NASIG conference a representative of a small publisher that
is
> registered with SERU said she pushed very hard with their legal person
who
> finally accepted it.  Also, she said that when I am trying to license
with a
> small publisher, I should direct them to SERU and ask if they would
register
> since she believes many of the small publishers are unaware of SERU or
the
> savings of it.
>
>
>
> Carol Ficken
>
> Coordinator, Library Acquisitions
>
> University Libraries
>
> Bierce Library - Acquisitions
>
> University of Akron
>
> Akron, OH 44325-1708
>
> Phone:  330.972.7296
>
> Fax:  330.972.5132
>
> Email:  cficken@xxxxxxxxxx 
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
>
> From: seruinfo@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:seruinfo@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf
Of Jody
> Atkinson
>
> Sent: Monday, June 14, 2010 3:48 AM
>
> To: lwobbe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx; seruinfo@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
>
> Subject: RE: [seruinfo] Cost?
>
>
>
> Thankyou to everyone who replied!
>
>
>
> I'm hoping we do use SERU, even if the number of publishers (at the
>
> moment) is not large.  Hopefully the  numbers will grow.
>
>
>
> Cheers
>
> Jody
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
>
> From: Linda Wobbe [mailto:lwobbe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx] ;
>
> Sent: Monday, 14 June 2010 11:26 AM
>
> To: Jody Atkinson; seruinfo@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
>
> Subject: Re: [seruinfo] Cost?
>
>
>
> Hi,
>
>
>
> I hope you give SERU a try. For ages we've complained about wasting
time
>
>
>
> with licenses. Here is a standard way to do away with them which
>
> preserves fair use rights!
>
>
>
> We are registered, as is the consortium I work with, SCELC. I can
>
> confirm there is no cost. SCELC has worked with several publishers who
>
> are registered with SERU, including Springer and Project Euclid. I
just
>
> wish more publishers would join!
>
>
>
> ...Linda
>
>
>
> Linda Wobbe Head, Collection Management/ Saint Mary's College Library/
>
> 1928 Saint Mary's Road/ Moraga, CA 94583-4290/ ph(925)631-4232;
>
> fx(925)376-6097
>
>
>
> On 6/13/10 6:57 PM, Jody Atkinson wrote:
>
>>
>
>> Hello
>
>>
>
>> My library has asked me to look into SERU to determine if we want to
>
>> use it. I can't find anything that refers to any cost involved in
>
>> signing up or using SERU - can someone confirm that it is free to use
>
> it?
>
>>
>
>> I would also be interested in hearing from other libraries using
SERU.
>
>
>
>> Do you find it useful? Are many publishers / vendors you subscribe
>
>> from willing to use it?
>
>>
>
>> Thankyou
>
>>
>
>> Jody Atkinson
>
>>
>
>> Resources and Access
>
>> Curtin University Library
>
>> Tel: 08 9266 4081
>
>> Email : j.atkinson@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
>
>>
>
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